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Thread: > 2003 StrangeWill bitches about Hillary being slimey and untrustworthy

  1. #1
    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    > 2003 StrangeWill bitches about Hillary being slimey and untrustworthy

    > GG shits all over him, calls him names.

    > 2017, insider Democratic information is dropped that Hillary literally buys the DNC nomination in 2016 election, because fuck democracy, she wants the presidency.

    Called it, kiss my ass.

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Also: if there is one thing that'll bring GG back it's political turmoil, come on with all the shit going on we should have at least a hundred threads.

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Also, I'm feeling extra salty tonight about a lot of things, I think I'm crossing into an old man.

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    Only JAMMA Games Need Apply Grizzled Veteran
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    As someone who has been active with the Democratic Party since 2006 now, I think that characterization is ridiculous. I also think it is ridiculous when someone who is not even a member of the party expects the party to support them despite them never helping a single Democrat ever get elected.

    And no, I'm not a Hillary fan. Personally hoping for Cory Booker. Just tired of the drama and mischaracterizations.

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reflex View Post
    As someone who has been active with the Democratic Party since 2006 now, I think that characterization is ridiculous.
    It's no longer just a "characterization".

    I also think it is ridiculous when someone who is not even a member of the party expects the party to support them despite them never helping a single Democrat ever get elected.
    So the DNC should be encouraged to work against someone because they've determined they're untrustworthy? That's kind of fucked.

    Just tired of the drama
    Holy fuck that's all that the Democratic party was in 2016, it was fucking insane. The deal though is every bit of it was self-inflected.
    Last edited by StrangeWill; 11-12-2017 at 04:03 AM.

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    Yes, it is actually a characterization. And an unfair one at that. It is normal for the party apparatus to be heavily influenced by those who contribute money, time and effort to getting Democrats elected. It is designed to function that way, rather than being an organization that can be hijacked by any outside force that chooses to carry their banner. This is true of how the Republicans and other smaller parties operate as well. Actually spending decades helping Democrats up and down the ballot get elected goes a long way towards receiving party support when running for office, and that is a good thing.

    I find it absolutely bizarre that people seem to believe that loyalty should have zero value to an organization and that resources should be spent on anyone who walks through the door. Republicans fought tooth and nail against Trump for the exact same reasons, the difference is that the Democrats won their fight against their demagogue and are being villainized for it.

    Yes, anyone does and should have the right to run for president. That does not grant them the right to any political party's resources simply because they choose to temporarily put a D or an R next to their name. Neither Sanders nor Trump contributed to or spent time fighting for their party's candidates or platforms, and neither deserved their party's unconditional support. Had Trump lost the primaries we'd be having the exact same discussions about him vs the Republican establishment candidate who won or lost the election. And it would be just as ill-informed a conversation.

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    So basically what you're telling me is that people like Donna Brazile know nothing of our political system and should not be surprised that this happened and should have not blown the whistle all because a die-hard Democrat member thinks it's all okay because if you don't pay tithe to the party the party is allowed to conspire against you? Because of a party you've admitted you're going to be really biased in terms of supporting...

    If anything I'd say that the Republicans had one thing up on Democrats, they refused to let the elite class make a decision on behalf of them, they elected someone their establishment rejected so fucking hard. The Democrats rolled over and continue to roll over and make excuses for what happened with Hillary, it's fucking gross.

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    Donna Brazile is welcome to her opinion, one hundreds of Democrats signed a letter disagreeing with formally. To many of us her statements on the topic appear opportunistic and designed to endear herself to a group that she may see a political future with. But her motives are her own.

    You have declined to respond to my actual points. I won't engage further until you actually discuss the topic rather than ranting about something you clearly do not have any real experience with.

    And yes, it has worked out *so well* for the Republicans. The problem with what happened there is that they actually got what they claimed they wanted. And its been a disaster ever since.

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    It's a cardigan, but thanks for noticing! Hardcore Veteran -Cerberus-'s Avatar
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    I'm with you strange. I'm not a trump fanboy as I'm a libertarian and I see most repubs as outdated fuds and democrats as seemingly communist morons. If things keep going the way they're going with the economy I'll vote for Trump again. BTW, I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by -Cerberus- View Post
    I'm with you strange. I'm not a trump fanboy as I'm a libertarian and I see most repubs as outdated fuds and democrats as seemingly communist morons. If things keep going the way they're going with the economy I'll vote for Trump again. BTW, I'm baaaaaaaaaaack!
    I never bought into voting "against" someone, just means I'm supporting a different kind of bullshit when in actuality I support neither. I hope the Dems can put someone worth my vote next time around or I'll just be eating popcorn next election (again).

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    oderint dum metuant Epic Poster madbomber1998's Avatar
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    For years now, people from both sides desperately wanted an outsider to come in and shake up Washington.

    Now they have their wish, for good or for bad.

    And yea Strangewill - it amazes me how defensive people are of Hillary. I mean, for god's sake, it's not like someone is smearing someone legit. It's Hillary 'I want to be Lord Emperor of the Planet' Clinton.

    (Rand Paul 2020!)

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    Accuracy matters. I am not a Hillary fan. I did not want her to get through the primary (nor Bernie). There was a lack of great candidates on the Dem side, and the Rep side had too many resulting in one of the worst options (Cruz being the other) getting through.

    But not being a fan of someone is not an excuse to smear them or attribute criminal behavior to them. I resisted it when Democrats aggressively referred to GWB as a criminal and inferred various unsavory motives to him. I certainly do not agree with him on a lot of positions, and while I voted for him in 2000 he had lost my vote by 2004. But not agreeing with him and how he ran the government was not the same things as ascribing deceptive or criminal motivations to him.

    Similarly I have avoided playing into the conspiratal aspects of Trump. I'll wait and see what Robert Mueller produces before drawing any conclusions. I admit it does not look good for this administration, but the facts are not in yet and coincidence is not the same as criminal behavior. My criticisms of Trump relate to the fact that he is a racist, misogynist and completely ignorant of policy or process. Given the responsibility of the office, I believe he is unfit for the job and always was. If he engaged in criminal behavior, I'll support removing him by legal means. If he did not, I will support removing him due to general incompetence via the 2020 election. If he changes his stripes on those issues I will support re-electing him.

    At the end of the day though, I don't support nationalism in any form. History has demonstrated its outcome is never a good thing. If given a choice between a competent nationalist and a useless internationalist I will always choose the latter because the former regardless of competence has never resulted in a good outcome. This is why I voted for Clinton. This is why I am likely to vote against Trump regardless of who his opponent is in 2020. So far the only possible contender who would give me pause in that choice is Bernie, who is a nationalist of a different stripe and might force me to not vote at all.

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    Run! Elite Poster StrangeWill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by madbomber1998 View Post
    For years now, people from both sides desperately wanted an outsider to come in and shake up Washington.
    This has already been predicted by some political scientists, this isn't a surprise...

    A lot of middle class or ex-middle class Americans have been struggling, the Democrats promised to fix that then completely failed, globalism was herald as the thing that pushes our societies forward and it's ultimate flop in a lot of communities is one of the factors why nationalism is surging again. When in reality it's helped the poor a little, trashed the middle class and made the rich even richer. Identity politics pushed these communities to the back of the line as far as Democrats were concerned.

    Blythe made a big point that Americans will throw their vote at any chance to make actual change, and Trump was a dangerous vote on that, but ultimately the Democrats solid their anti-status quo vote up the river and paid for it. A chance at something new is worth what has continued to be nothing but pain for the average American. It's why a lot of people voted Obama in 2008 and it's why a lot of Obama heavy states flipped in 2016.

    Quote Originally Posted by madbomber1998 View Post
    And yea Strangewill - it amazes me how defensive people are of Hillary. I mean, for god's sake, it's not like someone is smearing someone legit. It's Hillary 'I want to be Lord Emperor of the Planet' Clinton.
    Tribalism is a hell of a drug.
    Last edited by StrangeWill; 12-08-2017 at 02:50 AM.

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    Registered User Elite Poster Ryan The Ruler's Avatar
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    hmmmmmm!!

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